Ingame mechanics of following

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Elestir
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Location: Olomouc, Czech Republic
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Ingame mechanics of following

Post by Elestir » Fri Apr 18, 2008 4:11 pm

Current behavior of movement in MUME:
You are moved to nearby room and if the movement didn't happen indoors you also suffer a small delay (0.25 sec).
(exception is fleeing, which doesn't seem to have this post-delay)

Current behavior of follow in MUME:
When leader moves he suffers the post-delay, but the followers do not.

Is this wanted behavior? Why should followers have any bonuses like this? I think it gives ridiculous advantage to larger groups over smaller groups and solo players and is the most important feature abused by many overkillers, as it means that even if you are faster then the pursuers and leave the room 0.25 sec before them, it is not guaranteed that you won't get hit in the next room by one of the followers while their leader is still in the move-delay.

Wobbler
Posts: 393
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 10:02 pm

Re: Ingame mechanics of following

Post by Wobbler » Sat Apr 19, 2008 3:29 pm

Giving it some thought, I've decided I think it would be better to give followers delay too; however, it is important that this delay does not keep anyone too busy following to be able to stop following (compare to commands entered by a sneaker following someone that are never executed).

Related delays that need an overview include the no-line-of-sight delay for someone failing to engage in melee combat, which I think is far too long.
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Rogon
Posts: 158
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 4:49 pm

Re: Ingame mechanics of following

Post by Rogon » Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:32 pm

I thought the delay for the leader happened before you were moved into the next room, not once you were in it. If so this whole argument is flawed. I'll see if I can find a bunch of mounts or something and verify though ;)

Elestir
Posts: 231
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2008 11:47 pm
Location: Olomouc, Czech Republic
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Re: Ingame mechanics of following

Post by Elestir » Sun Apr 20, 2008 1:47 pm

Rogon wrote:I thought the delay for the leader happened before you were moved into the next room, not once you were in it. If so this whole argument is flawed. I'll see if I can find a bunch of mounts or something and verify though ;)
I am pretty sure that I am right and the delay comes *after* the movement. And thinking about it more I think there is problem even when leading a group indoors (without any leadership delays), as even then follower can attack at the same time his leader is moving. There is just random factor of whether follower's attacking command will be executed prior or after the leader's movement.

It works like this for group of size 2 (i.e. no extra leadership delays):
There are 2 scenarios:
  1. Code: Select all

    Time          Events
       1          Leader moves from room A to B
                  Follower attempts to attack the target [in room B]
       2          In case of outdoor movement, leader is in delay
                  Follower attempts to attack the target [in room B]
       3          Leader is no longer in delay...
    

    Code: Select all

    Time          Events
       1          Follower attempts to attack the target [in room A] (but the target is gone)
                  Leader moves from room A to B
       2          In case of outdoor movement, leader is in delay
                  Follower attempts to attack the target [in room B]
       3          Leader is no longer in delay...
    
As you see, while in outdoors, follower has 2 more heartbeats when he can attack the target while his leader is occupied by movement, indoors it's still 1 heartbeat. This is of course mainly problem in scenario 1 (which basically imho contains 2 bugs, scenario 2 just one).

I think that at the very least, once the leader's movement command gets executed, all followers should acquire same base movement delay as well. Whether some sort of extra leadership delays should be applied is another question (I for one would prefer no extra delay for the leader but delays for the followers, depending on their position, but as Wobbler said, they should have chance to stop following even in those delays. It's just silly that followers (while entering rooms after their leader) have 1st chance to act and are not bothered with the fact they are moving as well.

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